http://www.biblebabble.com/godl01.htm

Here is my problem. I think the popular theory is that the bible was oral tradition for many years. We all know how unlikely it is for a verbal message to be exchanged between 20 people over 10 minutes of time and remain intact and contain original content, much less when it is spread out over many years.

We also know that there are a good portion of people in this world today who would do almost anything to make a buck. Look at these giant corporations that have been falling as of recent.

A reasonable assumption is that man has always been greedy and power hungry. As detailed in the above site, it shows how the Roman Empire used Christianity to remain powerfull.

If you honestly take an objective look at the origins of the bible, not biased by your current beliefs (not possible) then perhaps you can gain some understanding as to why more and more people are leaning away from it. Especially when almost every story of the bible quite apparently is a rerun of an ancient pagan tale.

Not to mention the things preached such as slavery, oppression of woman, orders of murdering entire villages. Lets not forget gods big grand finish, the destruction of humanity. Is this really the type of things you want to guide the world into the future?

And with such questionable origins, how can one of christian following so blatantly ignore the facts when they are as plain as day.

Christian documentation belongs in the same section of the library as Zeus and Gilgamesh; Mythology.

Or is it that uncovering the origins of the source of your beliefs scares you?

The fact that alot of history does not agree with storys of the bible should definetly bother a person who believes its the untouched word of god.

The fact that alot of the storys of the bible are mere clones of other ancient storys should also worry the above mentioned individual.

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A reasonable assumption is that man has always been greedy and power hungry. As detailed in the above site, it shows how the Roman Empire used Christianity to remain powerfull.

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Actually, Rome prospered on account of their military advantages(I don't want to go into detail, it'd steer us off topic) and the fact that their trade routes where immune from robbers(as they were common in those days). The safe trade routes attracted merchants from all over the known world so the government got a lot of profit form the diverse stuff brought from the merchants. Religion was hardly the case.
You know, the King James bible was altered by King James. He didn't like something about it ( I'm not sure what) so he just altered it.
Check this site out (courtesy of Psyber Freek, for he reccomended it to me)
www.carn.org to read the other side of the story. It would be wise to learn both sides of the story before one chooses which is best in his opinion.

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Rome prospered on account of their military advantages

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And towards the time Christianity came on the scene, there "advantages" were quickly fading away. You can deny the ways christianity has/is used to oppress people, but its still the truth.

Anyway.....
Are you saying that Christianity causes oppression? No, it doesn't. People attribute it to oppression 'cause other people use it as a tool (which is defined as peaceful) to oppress.

christians retarded, prevented, medical knowage in every way they could

there for CHRISTIANS HAVE KILLED OVER A BILLION PEOPLE
and had many inter christian wars
and crusades in their 1600 year rain of terror

and are still today in the USA trying to
limit medical procedures like
abortions, and worse research on stem cells from them too
clones and several other ways, that all are wrong and the fool christians cost lifes even today with their fairytale and the way they want the bible to be made into our LAWS
is there any real difference in the christians GODS LAWS and the very program the tali-ban used in afgan??? exct for the burka???????

One thing not mentioned is that the OT was cannonized by the Hebrews before the birth of Christ. Mr. Godl makes it sound like they could not decide on what books to use in the entire Bible until 787AD.

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I think the popular theory is that the bible was oral tradition for many years. We all know how unlikely it is for a verbal message to be exchanged between 20 people over 10 minutes of time and remain intact and contain original content, much less when it is spread out over many years.

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If you honestly take an objective look at the origins of the bible, not biased by your current beliefs (not possible) then perhaps you can gain some understanding as to why more and more people are leaning away from it.

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Especially when almost every story of the bible quite apparently is a rerun of an ancient pagan tale.

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The fact that alot of history does not agree with storys of the bible should definetly bother a person who believes its the untouched word of god.

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"God wants Spiritual fruit not religious nuts"
- Community Fellowship Baptist Church Sign

Maybe if we take it down a notch.
http://www.historyforkids.org/learn/romans/history/fall.htm
Some weak rulers (the sons) could not keep their empire(s) together. Arcadius and Honorius weakened the entire Empire. At which time the Germans and Goths (long standing enemies of Rome) saw a prime opportunity to march against the Empire. ANd they did...along with all of the other groups the Romans upset in their long history...the Vandals, the Visigoths, and more.

From the book: General Observations on the Fall of the Roman Empire in the West by Edward Gibbon
http://www.fordham.edu/halsall/source/gibbon-fall.html

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But the decline of Rome was the natural and inevitable effect of immoderate greatness. Prosperity ripened the principle of decay; the causes of destruction multiplied with the extent of conquest; and, as soon as time or accident had removed the artificial supports, the stupendous fabric yielded to the pressure of its own weight

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http://encarta.msn.com/encnet/refpages/refarticle.aspx?refid=761578474
Encarta even mentions the fall of the Roman empire being attributed primarily to the Empire being to large that no one emperor could control and protect it.
That page also does a great job of walking one through the entire middle ages. Take a read.

"God wants Spiritual fruit not religious nuts"
- Community Fellowship Baptist Church Sign

I would also like to reccomend that you review your history, before making unsubstantiated accusations.

And MajinVegeta why couldn't a murderer be a Christian? They are just as welcome into heaven as anyone else. You will notice all through Jesus' life he hanged out with adulterers, murders and the general outcast community. One sheep found causes a larger celebration than one that stayed. Lost son parable?

As to Magashawn and Rayb Christianity basically hald up modern civilation during the dark ages. The monks and nuns kept writing around. As Tog_Neve said oral tradition is amazingly accurate. It has also been found that Bibles found only a few hundred years ago match up with those huge found many many many years ago. I would say also that since the Bible is still around and has been around a long time ago that it is most likely true. The problem people have with the old testament is context. The creation story and the earliest stories were writtem for fellas that thought the Earth was flat and that the sun orbited the Earth. Give them some credit!

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The creation story and the earliest stories were writtem for fellas that thought the Earth was flat and that the sun orbited the Earth. Give them some credit!

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Actually the men who wrote the bible were pretty accurate.

http://www.carm.org/bible/ms_science.htm

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christians retarted, prevented, medical knowage in every way they could

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Then I'm suprised that you're not a christian. hehehe, just kidding. A lot christians are actually pretty smart, like Hugh Ross for example. \

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and are still today in the USA trying to
limit medical procedures like
abortions, and worse research on stem cells from them too
clones and several other ways, that all are wrong and the fool christians cost lifes even today with their fairytale and the way they want the bible to be made into our LAWS

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If you're saying abortion and stem cell research are okay, you're also saying that it would be okay to kill you in you're sleep.

as for you're entire post, I'd say you just have an irrational fear of christianity in general. Don't worry, you'll get over it.

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Actually the men who wrote the bible were pretty accurate.

http://www.carm.org/bible/ms_science.htm

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Oh wow! In some places the bible is actually consistent with science. Golly that is unexpected! 9 truths from over 100 wrongs? Surely that proves the bible is right!

What did you think we mean? That every sentence of the bible is intentionally wrong in every way?

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Then I'm suprised that you're not a christian. hehehe, just kidding. A lot christians are actually pretty smart, like Hugh Ross for example.

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If you're saying abortion and stem cell research are okay, you're also saying that it would be okay to kill you in you're sleep.

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Originally posted by MajinVegeta:
RayB. You must realize that some people, although they call themselves Christians, they are not. Anyone could go right ahead and call themselves a Christian very easily, yet at the same time, they are not. A murderer could call himself one, right? Its very easy.
There are wars that are allowed in the bible, you know.

I would also like to reccomend that you review your history, before making unsubstantiated accusations.

www.dbzsc.com/vegeta34.jpg

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roman history is well recorded and clear
they did just fine untill they were conned into becoming CHRISTIAN
then all other belifes were banned, and christian citizens refused to fight or serve in the army and rome fell as a direct result of the christians ideas and practices
but sundays schools love to LIE and say rome fell because of coruption
well it was christian coruption, and BS that did them in

then came the christian ruled DARKAGE
the suppression of learning and science
the only one taught or allowed to read were the monks or the nobles
that did last 1000 years and church did suppress all knowlage
accuse medical doc's of being in leage with devils if too sucessfull
at cureing disease, and limit many other science and social ideas and allmost all progress too
which are your so callled unsubstantiated accusations???????
I call those facts truth
please post real facts not BS spin

and the more than a billion people are still dead befor their time as a direct result of the christians actions and the same evil is still trying to make or change LAWS TODAY!!!!

not to go into modern results from christian's GODS laws that are very like the tali-bans!!!!!!!!!